20:00 -!- ovrclokd [~lisa@moya.trilug.org] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:00 -!- Topic for #trilug-rhce: TriLUG RHCE Study Group - Next Meeting Wednesday March 26, 8pm IRC meeting, right here
20:00 -!- Topic set by jeremyp [] [Fri Mar 21 09:48:31 2003]
20:00 [Users #trilug-rhce]
20:00 [ ^retseJ] [ ant1gen] [ jeremyp] [ jimstigator] [ Nat_RH] [ ovrclokd]
20:00 -!- Irssi: #trilug-rhce: Total of 6 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 6 normal]
20:00 -!- Channel #trilug-rhce created Wed Feb  5 19:49:24 2003
20:00 -!- Irssi: Join to #trilug-rhce was synced in 1 secs
20:01 < ovrclokd> <voice type=dracula> good EEEvening... </voice>
20:02 < jeremyp> Hehe
20:02 < jeremyp> Good evening
20:03 -!- jtate [~chatzilla@rdu74-181-041.nc.rr.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:03 -!- sweeper [~mbroome@moya.trilug.org] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:03 < jeremyp> Evening jtate, sweeper .
20:04 < sweeper> evening, all
20:04 < jtate> Hi.
20:04 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: so, whatcha think about red hat's new release structure?
20:05 < ovrclokd> hi guys...
20:06  * ovrclokd thinks it's going to be a short irc session if nobody's talking
20:06 < jeremyp> Well, I"m not sure.  It's too bad there's such a cost different between RHL + RHN and RHEL
20:06 -!- daleth [~chrisk@moya.trilug.org] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:07 < jeremyp> See, RHEL is $349/year minimum, PLUS RHEN (enterprise network) subscription, vs $60/year for the basic RHN
20:07 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: ouch.  i wonder how that compares to windows xp server.  or solaris 9.
20:07 < daleth> Confused... do we still get the 1 free entitlement?
20:08 < jtate> Supposedly Windows server 2003 has a 180 dollar web server only version.
20:08 < daleth> But then you have to pay for the one guy to babysit/patch it.
20:08 < jtate> They're feeling heat over not having a cheap HTTP server offering.
20:08 < jeremyp> Yes, there's still a free entitlement if you fill out the survey every 60 days
20:09 < ovrclokd> jtate: yeah, but i wonder how much you have to pay in the annual software subscription fees under the new license structure.
20:09 < jeremyp> Plus for Windows you have to consider virus protection subscriptions
20:09 < jtate> You have to pay the linux guy too.
20:09 < jeremyp> Red Hat Linux has really lost a LOT of it's cost appeal
20:09 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: good point....
20:09 < daleth> jtate: Yeah, but the linux guy can manage many boxes from his desk, much easier than the windows guy.
20:10 < jtate> Well with RDP it's much easier to manage multiple Windows servers.
20:10 < daleth> (But the linux guy gets paid a smidge more... perhaps it all balances out.)
20:10 < jtate> Easier than logging into each machine individually.
20:10 < jeremyp> And the Widnows multiple-manage thing is basically free
20:10 < jtate> Remote desktop is pretty cool.
20:11 < jeremyp> Versus either multiple RHN entitlements (not free at all) or the proxy server thing (not free either, something like $2000 base plus $110 for each client that's
                 conencted)
20:11 < daleth> Ah... is this for XP?  or have I been missing something all these years?
20:11 < jtate> IIS is free if you have a valid Windows 2000 or XP license.
20:11 < jtate> It comes on the install cd even.
20:11 < daleth> But you need a client license for each concurrent hit.
20:11 < ovrclokd> jtate: yeah, but then you have to pay somebody fulltime just to keep up with security alerts and patches!
20:11 < daleth> Anyway, aren't we supposed to be talking about pink-hat or somesuch?
20:12 < jtate> I'm just as much a hater of M$ as the next bigot, but RH will have to drop their prices in response.
20:12 < ovrclokd> daleth: started out as a discussion of colorful-hat's new separate releases.
20:12 < jeremyp> Yeah, if you want to think about this more, see the excellent thread entitled "RHL 9 - Concerns" on the phoebe-list archives
20:12 < jtate> Or change their policies.
20:12 < jeremyp> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/phoebe-list/ and click on the archives link
20:12 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: thanks!
20:13 < daleth> jeremyp always there with the killer link.
20:13 -!- slundgren [~scottl@user-10lf60t.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:13 < daleth> (Still owe you something for that spamassassin link.)
20:13 < jtate> Ok.  I've got a printer hanging off a windows machine that I want to print to from my RH 7.3 box.
20:14 < jeremyp> What's neat about phoebe-list  is that is has replies from lots of Red Hat people, like Brent Fox and Matthew Wilson
20:14 < ovrclokd> jtate: sweeper set up our printers - he's wears the printer clue in the family. :)
20:14 < sweeper> I've setup printers on linux and accessed them from windows.  haven't done it the other way 'round, but it should work (via Samba)
20:14 < daleth> jtate.  I assume you aren't using a gomain.
20:14 < jeremyp> jtate: parallel printer, with no network interface ?
20:14 < daleth> s/gomain/domain/
20:15 < jeremyp> First make sure samba is up and running, and talking between the machines
20:15 < jeremyp> slundgren: welcome, by the way
20:15 < jtate> It is.
20:15 < jtate> Not a domain.  Samba is working.
20:15 < jeremyp> Then run redhat-config-printer and choose a samba pritner.  Done that yet ?
20:15 < slundgren> thanks, I was out of town for the last couple IRC meetings. I've appreciated the notes being up.
20:15 < jtate> LPRng is my printer controller.
20:16 < jeremyp> slundgren: IRC works out of town, that's the beauty of it  :)
20:16 < daleth> then you should just be able to go into the printer conf thingy and tell it is a samba printer, the IP the unc, (using / instead of \) and viola.
20:16 < jeremyp> yeah use //192.168.42.42/sharename
20:16 < daleth> (I had it setup and for some reason I'm hopeless with printers.)
20:16 < jeremyp> where ip and sharename are replaced as necessary
20:17 < daleth> or //host/share and in the IP field fill that out.
20:17 < slundgren> true, but I was unable to attend even that way.
20:18 < jtate> Can you use conquerer to browse to samba shares?
20:18 < jeremyp> you can use nautilus
20:18 < jeremyp> it doesn't work all that well though
20:19 < jtate> It looks like konquerer works too.
20:19 < jtate> Doesn't show the printers though.
20:19 < jtate> smb://
20:19 < jeremyp> Yeah it probably skips over printer shares
20:19 < daleth>  and you can't write to smb shares on konq.  (at least, you couldn't.)
20:21 < jtate> Ok.  Got it.
20:22 < jtate> Thanks.
20:22 < jeremyp> Okay, I guess RedWolfe and ccw aren't coming, or porthos, or cybertooth, or SinnerP, or ...
20:22 < jeremyp> Basically I wanted to:
20:23 < jeremyp> 1) post my updated notes which fixes typos
20:23 < jeremyp> and 2)  discuss a few thigns we didn't quite get to last wed.
20:23 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: such as?
20:24 < jeremyp> well we kinda ran real quick over the update agent I think
20:24 < jeremyp> THough maybe everyone is familiar with it?
20:24 < jtate> sheepishly: I've never used it
20:24 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: i'm not.  i've been using a utility called rhup, but i'd like to switch off it.
20:25 < jeremyp> For example, you can run "up2date blah" to install the "blah" package from RHN.  It will get dependencies for you automatically.
20:25 < sweeper> jeremyp: I only know it in passing from other people's discussions
20:25 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: never heard of that, and I thought I knew the Red Hat updater scene pretty well ...wow.  URL ?
20:26 < jeremyp> Well, you run up2date --rhn-register (Or just "rhn_register" in older versions, ie RHL 7.x), to register yourself with Red Hat Network
20:26 < jeremyp> Then you just run up2date to start up the GUI to update your system.  It is really blindingly simple.
20:26 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: hangon, digging in my bookmarks:
20:26 < daleth> jeremyp http://yasd.cc/en/rhup.php3
20:26 < daleth> ( I assume)
20:26 < jeremyp> It will skip over kernel updates by default, but you can check them off if you want
20:27 -!- cybertooth [~cybertoot@rdu163-124-248.nc.rr.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:27 < ovrclokd> daleth: beat me to it!
20:27 < jtate> Ok: What's the proper procedure when dealing with a GLIBC update like we had a week or so ago?  Reboot?  Reinit?
20:28 < daleth> I was intrigued.  I like current cause I know who to kill if it doesn't work.
20:28 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: what, if any, are the implications of registering with rhn?
20:28 < jeremyp> Does rhup not handle dependencies ?
20:28 -!- [ECL]rock [~n@cpe-024-211-148-035.nc.rr.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:28 < cybertooth> I thought libraries (that were in constant use) were not updated till a reset
20:28 < jeremyp> jtate: rebooting isn't really encessary, but if it's a security thing you might want to restart all your daemons
20:28 < jeremyp> No, the libraries are loaded when the application starts
20:29 < jeremyp> So certain things like "init" etc might not use the new libraries until a reboot, but that's probably not a big concern
20:29 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: well it costs $60/year unless you get a "demo" account
20:29 < cybertooth> So your running apps can start to look fairly jittery if the libraries are not backwards compatible
20:29 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: rhup doesn't handle dependencies.  it just checks existing updates against current versions.
20:30 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: then that sounds pretty useless. I would choose from 1) apt-get 2) yum 3) up2date w/ current server 4) up2date with nrh-current server before I'd use
                 something that doesn't do dependencies
20:30 < jeremyp> (assuming there's reasons you can't use the real RHN)
20:30 < jeremyp> s/nrh-current/nrh-up2date/
20:31 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: sorry, didn't mean to sound critical. Just that apt-get is realyl so easy :)
20:31 < slundgren> I've not heard of nrh-up2date, a link por favor?
20:31 < jeremyp> slundgren: nrh-up2date.org
20:31 < jtate> s/nrh/rhn/
20:32 < jeremyp> jtate: no
20:32 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: it is. *grin*  i'm just used to it.
20:32 < jeremyp> nhr = "not red hat"
20:32 < jeremyp> err, nrh
20:32 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: altho realistically i don't run into dependency problems as often as you might think.
20:33 < jeremyp> But there are some *issues* with the way nrh-up2date does things.  It was my fourth choice among those above
20:33 < jeremyp> The big issue being that it probably violates the RHN terms of service the way it works
20:33 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: how so?
20:33 < jeremyp> Seriously, if you want to use the up2date client with a custom server, I suggest the current server (current.tigris.org)
20:33 < jeremyp> But apt-get and yum are the easiest
20:34 < jtate> I like yum a lot.
20:34 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: because it uses up2date with official RHN on the server box, to get the 'upstream' updates.
20:34 < jeremyp> Sure, the stuff is GPL so restributing them is allowed to some extent.  But it's really against what RHN is supposed to do
20:34 < jeremyp> Current does it the "proper" way by relying on the normal FTP mirror
20:35 < jeremyp> This is somehwat off-topic.
20:35 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: makes sense.
20:36 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: in response to, "realistically i don't run into dependency
20:36 < jeremyp>                      problems as often as you might think"
20:36 < jeremyp> I very often run into them
20:36 < jeremyp> Mainly because I use these tools to both install new packages and update existing ones
20:37 < jeremyp> And it has happened a number of times that updated packages will require new packages that didn't previously exist (Apache did that a while back for example)
20:37 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: *nods*  update-requires-new-package is what i run into.
20:37 < cybertooth> Well that is one of the inherent problems of package management systems
20:37 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: i usually install new stuff manually - since i'm only running 2 systems, i haven't had a need for volume management yet.
20:37 < jeremyp> cybertooth: not a problem, it's a feature!
20:38 < cybertooth> You have to have the same level of libraries etc as the man who made the package
20:38 < jeremyp> ovrclokd: yeah, that gets tiresome on your third system for sure :)
20:38 < jeremyp> cybertooth: oh, well that's true
20:38 < jtate> In the system logging portion of last week's meeting: where's a good place to look if you run into something strange in the logs?
20:38 < jtate> Besides google groups I mean.
20:39 < jeremyp> Well, you should be able to tell what program or module generated the log entry
20:39 < cybertooth> I really like the package management system as a starting ground (and an easy way of applying initial updates) , but I'm not married to it.
20:40 < jeremyp> Well the features like "rpm -ql" and "rpm -qf" are invaluable to me.  If I had a bunch of stuff installed via source, I'd have a much harder life when figuring
                 things out
20:40 < jeremyp> I can't keep track of thousands of files manually
20:40 < jeremyp> (note to others, this is sort of an ongoing debate between cybertooth and me, we should probably skip that for now...)
20:41 < cybertooth> I normally don't muck with my servers much after they are up and running - pretty much do security updates is all.
20:41 < jtate> Yeah, that's not usually a problem, but for example: last week I was getting some strange stuff in my sendmail log.  I posted to trilug.  I got a response
               quickly, but I'd rather be more self sufficient.
20:41 < cybertooth> jtate: experience is the only answer to that
20:41 < jeremyp> Well, the sendmail documentation should have explanations of the common error messages and stuff
20:41 < cybertooth> I had some very weird goings on with NFS a few years back and *no one* could help out
20:42 < jeremyp> But there's nothing wrong with Google, Google Groups, etc
20:42 < cybertooth> An intern and I went through the source code and used ethereal to watch everything
20:42 < cybertooth> We finally figured it out and submitted a patch...
20:43 < cybertooth> The moral of the story is that now I know NFS inside out.
20:43 < slundgren> how long did that take?
20:44 < jeremyp> Cool.  Then maybe you can tell me why I sometimes get "Stale NFS filehandle" errors on locally mounted CD-ROMs :)
20:44 < cybertooth> One very long night.  We had our fix by about 6am the next morning
20:44 < jeremyp> Was your patch accepted
20:44 < jeremyp> ?
20:44 < cybertooth> The maintainers sent us a better fix by noon that day
20:45 < cybertooth> The patch was just a hack for our use, they did a more general one that worked a lot better
20:45 < jeremyp> Cool.
20:45 < cybertooth> Are the cdroms mounted via NFS?
20:45 -!- jtower [~jason@moya.trilug.org] has joined #trilug-rhce
20:45 < jtate> Is there a filesystem out there that allows access control lists like AFS, but without being, well, AFS?
20:46 < jeremyp> cybertooth: no, NFS isn't even installed on the machine :)
20:46 < cybertooth> I think you might want to examine the automount stuff
20:46 < jtate> I think I've outgrown the file permission schemes of ext.
20:46 < jeremyp> jtate: yes, ext3 with the HTree stuff does that
20:46  * jtower is a total doofus.  forgot about this two weeks in a row
20:46 < jeremyp> it was supposed to be included in RHL 9, but it might have been taken out... we'll see next week when it's released
20:46 < jeremyp> it's in the 2.5 kernel but Red Hat was going to backport it
20:47 < cybertooth> I haven't seen the HTree stuff...?
20:47 < jeremyp> referred to more generically as "ACLs" (access control lists)
20:47 < jtate> Right.  I loved them when I was at Duke.
20:48 < jtate> Such fine grained control.  Muuaaahhahaha
20:48 < jeremyp> rlidkwa ?  :)
20:48 < jtate> Yep.
20:48 < cybertooth> Is it an addon like quota's or is an extention of ext filesystem
20:49 < cybertooth> *got to go take out the trash (a commandment from she who must be obeyed)*
20:49 < jeremyp> cybertooth: extension of the filesystem IIRC
20:49 < sweeper> speaking on RHL 9.0, somebody on the linux list at work posted a link to a review
20:49 < sweeper> http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=3119
20:49 < jeremyp> With add-ons to both kernel and userland tools, which makes sense of course for this type of thing
20:49 < cybertooth> Cool then we get ACL's for free
20:49 < jeremyp> sweeper: it's RHL 9, not 9.0
20:49 < jtate> Link please.  Google doesn't seem to be turning up anything but the code for the patch.
20:50 -!- slundgren is now known as scottl
20:50 < ovrclokd> jtower: we love you anyway...
20:50 < sweeper> jeremyp: really??  I musta missed that in all the chatter (on the various lists)
20:50 < sweeper> so they've done away with ALL plans for future .x releases?
20:51 < jeremyp> jtate: I wish I knew more, this is all what I remember from the phoebe-list (link posted previously)
20:51 < jeremyp> sweeper: well, not necessarily.  RHL 7 was just that, and there was a 7.1, 7.2, 7.3
20:52 < jeremyp> But I think that's the scuttlebut.  Red Hat makes no promises on this stuff
20:52 < jtate> Hmm.  In the mean time what kinds of permission schemes are available in Reiser or XFS?
20:52 < sweeper> jeremyp: oh, so it's just a semantic game to claim that they don't have .0 releases ;)
20:52 < jeremyp> Nothing different from standard POSIX that I know of
20:52 < jeremyp> jtate: you are familiar with setgid stuff, right?  I talked about that setup briefly last week
20:53 < jeremyp> sweeper: I guess.  People are probably making a bigger deal of it than they ought to.
20:54 < jeremyp> Oh, that OSNews review -- It's "tiresome" to me that the review (and others) criticize Red Hat for not including MP3 support, DVD player apps, etc.
20:54  * ovrclokd is hungry, going to grab some food, brb
20:55 < jeremyp> Why can't people get it through their head that those things CANNOT be legally redistributed in the United States !?!
20:55 < jtower> osnews reviews are totally useless
20:55 < jeremyp> Red Hat is not shipping that stuff because it's FREAKIN AGAINST THE LAW
20:55 < sweeper> jeremyp: I didn't read it at criticism so mcuh as statement of fact of something desktop users are interested in, but I agree it's tiresome
20:55 < jeremyp> Not that it's a good law, and we should all lobby the appropriate parties, but sheesh
20:56 < jtower> jeremyp: but mandrake/suse/etc sell it in the US, no?  what's the difference
20:56 < jtower> *IANAL*
20:57 < jeremyp> Well they don't sell the DVD player stuff, which is against the DMCA
20:57 < jtower> ah
20:57 < jtower> thanks god for freshrpms and apt
20:58 < jtower> well, i can personally report that setting up LVM from scratch is not as hard as it may sound
20:58  * jtower is still on his LVM kick
20:59 < jeremyp> And Mandrake et all could probably get in trouble for the MP3 support, if the MP3 folks really started flexing their muscle.  Red Hat is taking a much more
                 "responsible" approach
21:00 < jtower> i'm gonna re-rip my CDs into ogg one of these days
21:00 -!- [ECL]rock [~n@cpe-024-211-148-035.nc.rr.com] has quit []
21:00 < ovrclokd> jtower: d'you know if there are any car cd players that support ogg?
21:01 < jtower> no idea at all
21:01 < jeremyp> OH, one more thing related to up2date and RHN -- there's a thing called "rhnsd" that can monitor RHN automatically for new updates
21:01 < jeremyp> I haven't been able to get a real good handle on how it actually works
21:01 -!- [ECL]rock [~n@cpe-024-211-148-035.nc.rr.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
21:02 < scottl> stupid question, offtopic. what is the keyboard shortcut for moving between workspaces on RH 8?
21:02 < jeremyp> It's installed by default but doesn't appear to really *do* anything by default
21:02 < jtate> There's another option too: If you've installed ximian gnome, you can use red-carpet.
21:02 < jeremyp> Eegads
21:02 < jtate> alt plus F<desktop number>
21:02 < jeremyp> Yes, it's another option, but Ximian plays such havoc with your RPMs that you basically have to re-format if you want to go back
21:03 < jeremyp> Notice how the Ximian Red Carpet disclaimer is always one of the first things in the RHL release notes :)
21:03 < jtate> Unless you have KDE installed: then you use Ctrl F1, etc.
21:03 < jeremyp> jtate: cool, thanks.  Didn't know about either of those (I use KDE here and Gnome at work, trying to get the best of both worlds0
21:04 -!- scottl [~scottl@user-10lf60t.cable.mindspring.com] has left #trilug-rhce []
21:04 < jtate> What I'd like to set up is a roaming KDE or Gnome profile, so no matter where I log in, I have the same shortcuts, etc.
21:04 < jtate> Would LDAP be able to handle that?
21:04 < jtate> Roaming mozilla profiles too?
21:05 < ovrclokd> jtate: i have kde installed - i have to use ctrl-alt-fX
21:05 < jtate> (Anyone know how those work?)
21:05 < jeremyp> I don't think mozilla has roaming profiles.  There's some consternation among mozilla hackers about that
21:06 < jeremyp> Some of the mozilla clones (galeon?) do have them however
21:06 < jtate> Fair enough.  They do have profiles though, so I assumed...  I've never look at that to set it up.
21:06 -!- scottl [~scottl@user-10lf60t.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
21:06 < jeremyp> Well ideally you could just do NFS-mounted home directories... or do you mean roaming across the Internet ?
21:06 < jtate> Across the internet.
21:07 < jtower> that's what vnc is for :)
21:07 < jtate> That's why I'm looking at LDAPS or similar.
21:04 < jtate> Would LDAP be able to handle that?
21:04 < jtate> Roaming mozilla profiles too?
21:05 < ovrclokd> jtate: i have kde installed - i have to use ctrl-alt-fX
21:05 < jtate> (Anyone know how those work?)
21:05 < jeremyp> I don't think mozilla has roaming profiles.  There's some consternation among mozilla hackers about that
21:06 < jeremyp> Some of the mozilla clones (galeon?) do have them however
21:06 < jtate> Fair enough.  They do have profiles though, so I assumed...  I've never look at that to set it up.
21:06 -!- scottl [~scottl@user-10lf60t.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #trilug-rhce
21:06 < jeremyp> Well ideally you could just do NFS-mounted home directories... or do you mean roaming across the Internet ?
21:06 < jtate> Across the internet.
21:07 < jtower> that's what vnc is for :)
21:07 < jtate> That's why I'm looking at LDAPS or similar.
21:07 < jtate> VNC is just too slow
21:07  * sweeper has to go walk the dog ....
21:07 < jtate> I
21:08 < jeremyp> I've not quite heard of storing whole big files in LDAP
21:08 < jeremyp> LDAP is really designed for "directory" data -- many many records of small pieces of stuff
21:08 < jtower> if you play with the protocol parameters vnc can be made fairly tolerable
21:08 < jtate> So configuration should be ok too:
21:09 < jeremyp> Yeah but configuration files are a lot more than "name, UID, password, phone number"
21:09 < jeremyp> I'm sure you could hack something into it, and I wouldnt' be surprised if people have done it, but that's not the real point of LDAP
21:10 < jtate> Yeah, I'm looking at doing an LDAP setup for an addressbook accessible through mozilla mail.  Thought maybe I could do it all through there.
21:10 < cybertooth> Up a few pages you mentioned RHN monitor, I have it running on my desktop.  works good
21:11 < jeremyp> Ok, question for those who are following the syllabus /etc -- is there a section for quotas, automounter, NFS home directories, etc ?
21:11 < jeremyp> That stuff is covered on RHCT so we need to make sure we cover it somewhere
21:11 < cybertooth> We definitely need to know automount, that's a enterprise type application
21:11 < jeremyp> cybertooth: actually I was talking about rhnsd, which is the background daemon that can install stuff automatically (I think).  YOu're right, though, rhn-applet
                 is neat also.
21:12 < cybertooth> auto-mount with NFS would be fair game for the test
21:13 < ovrclokd>  nfs server is in meeting 5 - mike or i will cover that...
21:13 < cybertooth> You would need to setup an automount for the users home directory when they logged in (we did this at a former employer)
21:13 < jeremyp> yeah but automount is a different beast
21:14 < ovrclokd> jeremyp: makes sense to bundle them together, tho.
21:14 < jeremyp> though certainly related to nfs client/server setup.  Automount can mount anything though
21:14 < ovrclokd> quotas probably fits best in meeting 8 - user and host security
21:14 < jtower> maybe we need a session for "common tips, tricks, and setups"
21:15 < jeremyp> jtower: yeah that could last all night though :)
21:15 < jtate> Is there an NFS type file sharing protocol that works well over the internet?  Besides Samba I mean.
21:15 < jtower> i volunteer cybertooth to lead that one
21:15 < jeremyp> Though it would probably be really handy to bring in Jason's server (or some server) and setup NIS, & NFS homedires, and then configure someone's laptop or
                 whatever as a client
21:16 < cybertooth> Well you can do NFS over the internet - not recommended!
21:16 < jeremyp> jtate: I think webdav (sp?) is supposed to fill that void, I haven't played with it much
21:17 < cybertooth> I would love to teach nfs/nis - my schedule is iffy though...
21:17 < jtower> or use a VPN
21:17 < jtate> I think that's the next step.
21:17 < cybertooth> VPN is the way to go if you want remote NFS
21:17 < cybertooth> It is 2x faster than samba, but 4x slower than ftp
21:18 < jeremyp> Can samba over the Internet be made secure ?
21:18 < cybertooth> Yes you can tunnel it these days
21:18 < jtower> you can tunnel anything thru ssh
21:18 < cybertooth> I wish I could tunnel a pizza some days
21:19 < scottl> i don't think webDAV is a replacement for NFS.
21:19 < jtower> you can't make samba secure because the other end is usually a windoze box
21:19  * jeremyp curses his laptop which just told him battery power is critical at 7% -- yet the freakin thing is plugged into the wall !
21:20 < cybertooth> jeremyp, check the plug connection...
21:20 < jtower> jeremy's laptop is a steaming pile of goat-infested llama shit
21:20 < jtower> gotta sub for tribot
21:20 < cybertooth> Hay there's a bzflag contest about to begin... are we going to cover anything else tonight?
21:20 < jeremyp> cybertooth: good suggestion, but I'm pretty sure it is
21:21 < jeremyp> jtower: uh, thanks
21:24 < jeremyp> OKay, well I guess everyone's moving to bzflag
21:24 < jeremyp> Join us at bzflag.trilug.org port 5155 (bzflag.sourceforge.org for the client, even works on Windows and Mac!)
21:25 < jeremyp> And see #trilug for discussion :)
21:25 < ovrclokd> have fun, guys.  see you next week!
21:25 -!- scottl [~scottl@user-10lf60t.cable.mindspring.com] has left #trilug-rhce []