[TriLUG] somewhat OT: mac hardware

Tue Mar 30 08:56:57 EST 2004

The earlier post about machines that support dual-booting is incorrect.
You can dual boot many of the G4 series machines, the first ones through
several of the earliest "Quicksilver models", all of the Blue and White
G3s, and as far back on the PowerBooks as the WallStreet G3 (with my
limited early morning brain-power I may revise this post). As I had to
support the mac OS at one point in my former environment for too long,
there are many multi-boot options out there that I have found to be easy
to deal with. Most dealing with the version of Open Firmware on the
machine and not really dealing much with peripheral accessibility.

Particularly, MOL (mac on Linux) where you run an install from a
different partition inside a rootless window inside of Linux. Made my
life much easier with Linux being the alpha dog on the machine. And it
supports OS9 and OS.

1- A used dual G4 450, dual G4 533, etc would be your best bet for speed
and cost. And, all of the machines in this era have VGA agp cards or
provided adapters. My triple boot config was Debian/OSX/OS9 for the
longest while I needed the mac OS. I also ran Yellow Dog for a bit with
good success (Red Hat for PPC). Check out Mac-On-Linux for more
comfortable options. Tis the only thing that got me through the hard
times ;) http://www.maconlinux.org/

2- With regard to your kvm switch. There is a belkin switch out there
that does usb and ps2. Maybe a better option, and less expensive than
losing the desk real estate or the cost of another monitor, etc.. Not to
mention, I use mostly IBM hardware now, and they hate all of my PS2 only
switches. And by hate I mean: "Do not work at all." The upgrade to USB
on the switch option saved me.

3- I frequently changed ram between machines, and I can second the
comment about buying the good stuff. Just buy the good stuff.

Paul

On Tue, 2004-03-30 at 04:19, Jaimie Livingston wrote:
> Here's another useful link.
> http://www.apple.com/macosx/upgrade/requirements.html
> 
> This chart lists the systems that support OS10.3.x (Panther) and has
> pictures to help identify systems visually.
> 
> Jaimie
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: trilug-bounces at trilug.org [mailto:trilug-bounces at trilug.org] On Behalf
> Of Jaimie Livingston
> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 4:07 AM
> To: 'Triangle Linux Users Group discussion list'
> Subject: RE: [TriLUG] somewhat OT: mac hardware
> 
> 
> Others have chimed in, but here's my direct experience with the Mac's.
> 
> As a rule of thumb, to run OSX you need a Mac with built in USB. The
> beigebox G3 tower's and Rev 1 Powerbooks don't qualify, for example, since
> they do not have built-in USB. Most anything else, including the Blue &
> White G3's, iMacs, iBook, and G3 Cube do qualify. There are exceptions to
> the rule, and Apple and some others will list some older G3 systems as being
> able to support OSX 10.2.x. An example where documentation does not meet
> reality is the Beige G3 (Gossamer) towers. Some doc's list this system as
> being able to support OS 10.3.x, but I can tell you that the one on my desk
> will not - much to my annoyance ;^{   I have found that this chart for
> firmware updates for various systems to run OSX is a good place to start. If
> a system is not on this chart, it probably won't run OSX.
> 
> The only systems that I have heard of that can successfully support dual
> booting OS9 and OSX are the G3 PowerBooks, Platinum iMac, and the G3 Cube.
> That said, any USB system that has the ROM's to support a clean install of
> OS9 AND has built-in USB _should_ support dual booting.
> 
> Most of the Mac's in question use 3.3V unbuffered SDRAM. Apple is generally
> switching to DDR for newer systems, but that's not written in stone, either.
> Check the tech specs at Apple.com for better information on specific models.
> http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=19456
> 
> Video on Mac's is a mixed bag, and depends on the video system the unit was
> purchased with. Most newer one's will have either a standard PCI/AGP VGA
> adapter or a built-in DVI interface, and some may have both. Those that have
> DVI should have come with a DVI>VGA adapter. Don't assume that a given PCI
> or AGP video card that works in a Wintel system will work in a given Mac.
> Some do and some don't.
> 
> Apple.com provides good information on what systems can run which OS's and
> makes technical specs available for every model Apple has ever sold. If you
> have a specific purchase in mind, get the model number and check Apple.com
> before making a final decision.
> 
> In my opinion, the best $$ value for an OS10 system is the Power Macintosh
> G4's with the 733Mhz PPC 7450 chip and DVD SuperDrive. They were
> discontinued in mid-2001 and I've seen them on eBay for as little as $500.
> After that would be the Dual PPC G4 QuickSilver from 2002, but they don't
> come up often.
> 
> Good hunting,
> 
> Jaimie
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: trilug-bounces at trilug.org [mailto:trilug-bounces at trilug.org] On Behalf
> Of Jason Tower
> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:09 PM
> To: trilug at trilug.org
> Subject: [TriLUG] somewhat OT: mac hardware
> 
> 
> in order to better support a couple of clients who run macs, i'd like to 
> get myself a mac that i can use to acquaint myself with OS9 and OSX.  
> doesn't need to be a speed demon, but i shouldn't be a slug either.  
> i'm well versed in x86 hardware but clueless about macs - i've done 
> enough homework to know that i want a G4 (not a G3) to support the 
> altivec stuff, beyond that i have no idea what i should be looking for.  
> i know that quite a few triluggers run macs, so if anyone can help 
> point me in the right direction i'd appreciate it.
> 
> also, a couple of related questions:
> 
> - do G4's take standard PC100/133 ram?  i seem to recall someone saying 
> that they require 5v rather than the more common 3.3v stuff, is this 
> true?
> 
> - do they typically have ps/2 kbd/mouse ports and vga video?  i want to 
> hook it up to my raritan ps/2 kvm switch, due to space constraints a 
> seperate kbd/mouse/monitor are not an option.
> 
> thanks all - jason
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